|
Post by jackbquick on Apr 17, 2014 13:04:26 GMT -4
Glad to see you are finally getting with the program there JBQ! Yes, infrastructure down there is lacking to say the least. No sewer, privately owned roads, etc. You want my house JBQ? Its on sewer on a county road. It would have been a better investment than that house you have with a failed septic. Hey, but that must be my fault too. I must have made you buy a house with septic. And you call me crazy? Ok so the lack of infrastructure is sewer. What is this topic about again. Oh yes, getting sewer. So basic services should be for the elite who happen to live a little closer to the sewer plant.
|
|
|
Post by burnerbill on Apr 22, 2014 17:22:51 GMT -4
well, Lainey.. that line takes the cake! Are you implying the tax payers of QA county would be willing to buy me, and other residents of SKI, out? A much more expensive plan than running the sewer line given the number of homes. You do know that most homes in the affected communities have technically failing septic systems. It is not just about the ability to flush the toilet. Lastly, it appears your stance is no new residents should be allowed on the island? When do you want the fences and toll gates to go up? Nope, that is not my stance. My stance is no new houses down SKI. Infill all you want where there is adequate infrastructure. So.. you are in favor of Gibson's Grant, Four Seasons, Ellendale, Cloisters, Osprey Pointe and any other new development that can be built if it has access to sewer? All communities that have changed the landscape of the north end of KI as one can see from Rt 50, Rt 18 or Rt 8. Just pack them all in at the north end of the island, right? At least with sewer down Rt 8, the infill will be spread over 9 communities over a much larger area of KI than the north end and will not even be noticed from Rt 8 since all the roads and community entrances are already in place.
|
|
|
Post by alleycat on Apr 22, 2014 19:01:29 GMT -4
Glad to see you are finally getting with the program there JBQ! Yes, infrastructure down there is lacking to say the least. No sewer, privately owned roads, etc. You want my house JBQ? Its on sewer on a county road. It would have been a better investment than that house you have with a failed septic. Hey, but that must be my fault too. I must have made you buy a house with septic. And you call me crazy? Ok so the lack of infrastructure is sewer. What is this topic about again. Oh yes, getting sewer. So basic services should be for the elite who happen to live a little closer to the sewer plant. As I've said before, I'm staying out of this fight, but Just want to point out that before the sewer, there was no sewer. So we got sewer and became elite? it is, for example, my fault that they put the sewer where they did? Actually, I didn't want all that expense...being forced to do it, and find the money for sewer and water. I came here with no expectations of "basic services." I had well and septic. I now have water and sewer. My "basic" services didn't cost me anything. Now that I'm elite, I have bills. I'm not sure who has or hasn't a valid point on this issue. However, if there is sewage running down the streets and into the bay, maybe sewer service would be a good thing?
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on Apr 22, 2014 19:34:09 GMT -4
Ok so the lack of infrastructure is sewer. What is this topic about again. Oh yes, getting sewer. So basic services should be for the elite who happen to live a little closer to the sewer plant. As I've said before, I'm staying out of this fight, but Just want to point out that before the sewer, there was no sewer. So we got sewer and became elite? it is, for example, my fault that they put the sewer where they did? Actually, I didn't want all that expense...being forced to do it, and find the money for sewer and water. I came here with no expectations of "basic services." I had well and septic. I now have water and sewer. My "basic" services didn't cost me anything. Now that I'm elite, I have bills. I'm not sure who has or hasn't a valid point on this issue. However, if there is sewage running down the streets and into the bay, maybe sewer service would be a good thing? Hey, I mean if everyone should have a right to healthcare, we should have a right to sewer right. Lainey voted for those who thought everyone should have healthcare and I am surprised she is not for everyone having sewer.
|
|
|
Post by burnerbill on Apr 23, 2014 10:13:33 GMT -4
Ok so the lack of infrastructure is sewer. What is this topic about again. Oh yes, getting sewer. So basic services should be for the elite who happen to live a little closer to the sewer plant. As I've said before, I'm staying out of this fight, but Just want to point out that before the sewer, there was no sewer. So we got sewer and became elite? it is, for example, my fault that they put the sewer where they did? Actually, I didn't want all that expense...being forced to do it, and find the money for sewer and water. I came here with no expectations of "basic services." I had well and septic. I now have water and sewer. My "basic" services didn't cost me anything. Now that I'm elite, I have bills. I'm not sure who has or hasn't a valid point on this issue. However, if there is sewage running down the streets and into the bay, maybe sewer service would be a good thing?alleycat.. to your first highlighted point, I agree that no one wants an additional expense, especially when one feels what they have is currently working fine. Just because one can flush their toilet etc does not mean their septic field is operating properly. In my humble opinion, if most people can "get by" and avoid fixing something and live with it, most will. Hopefully, it will be someone else's problem one day. Secondly, that last point. If there weren't the concerns for ground water quality, health of the bay and creeks, would the county install sewer "just for the heck of it."? I do not see this being done as a result of pressure from developers, since there are no new developments, or the need for any, being planned in the SKI area. You have all these communities, in place for decades with all their lots and streets in place unfinished due to the moratorium against building new homes on septic in SKI. One wonders, for example, when the Four Seasons development gets started, and let's say about 60% is built out, would the county shut it down by saying enough homes have been built when it was approved for all the homes originally planned? Everyone knew of all the empty lots in the affected communities in SKI, what did one expect to happen to them and for the lot owners who have been waiting? Say: "Too bad, I was here first and have my home and you can't have yours now!" A position of many of the opponents.
|
|
|
Post by sendain on Apr 29, 2014 11:35:43 GMT -4
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on Apr 29, 2014 16:18:38 GMT -4
APFO does not apply to existing lots. Also, APFO is to make sure capacity is adequate in the schools which they are for the infill. Impact fees pay for that or the beach permit fee if the impact fees are not enough.
|
|
|
Post by j80sailer on Apr 29, 2014 20:31:55 GMT -4
|
|
|
Post by falgar25 on Apr 29, 2014 21:08:11 GMT -4
Unless things have changed (certainly possible) the system that is being proposed is the STEP system like the one described in your article. People *are* did look at cheaper alternatives.
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on Apr 30, 2014 7:50:03 GMT -4
Unless things have changed (certainly possible) the system that is being proposed is the STEP system like the one described in your article. People *are* did look at cheaper alternatives. This whole issue revolves around the fact that the State Law says you have to have 3 feet of separation between the bottom of the septic trenches and the groundwater table. The 6 or so residents recently told the Only alternative is holding tank had groundwater a few inches from the surface. All these other systems you hear about have to discharge the liquids one way or another into the septic field and if you do not have 3 feet of separation, they will not work. It is not the technology. It is the yard the waste goes into. You can't change that unless you truck it out for $70300 a month or pump it out by sewer line for $100. The problem with stalling for the inevitable permanent solution is YOU COULD BE NEXT to go on a holding tank and pay $700 a month to truck your waste. I DO NOT WANT TO BE NEXT. DO YOU.
|
|
dw
New Member
Posts: 11
|
Post by dw on Apr 30, 2014 12:38:11 GMT -4
|
|
|
Post by burnerbill on Apr 30, 2014 15:38:05 GMT -4
QACA is all about no growth and does not care for environmental issues since it poo-poohed the environmental concerns. Note its greatest concern is the new homes, homes which will be built in existing communities without the need to raze farmlands or clear cuts forests. The Riverkeeper is about environment and what is happening to our groundwater, creeks and the bay. The rain these last few days will provide some interesting talk at the meeting tomorrow night at KIHS as some folks will have some septic issues to deal with over the next few days.
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on Apr 30, 2014 18:33:31 GMT -4
I guess it means compromise is a lost word. I thought QACA was about protecting the farms, forests and open spaces as well as improving the quality of the bay? Glad to see at least the riverkeepers care about water quality!
|
|
|
Post by Frank on May 2, 2014 8:01:14 GMT -4
Well, it looks like it's time to get moving on this. Did anyone else got to the meeting last night? I left before the commission took any action.
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on May 2, 2014 8:19:14 GMT -4
Well, it looks like it's time to get moving on this. Did anyone else got to the meeting last night? I left before the commission took any action. I went. It was about 50/50 for and against. What stood out from all speeches was a single mom who lost the sale of her home last month because she was told she has to go on a holding tank because the buyers septic inspection failed. Very sad. Also, if anyone ever goes to these meetings, the usual characters of KIDL were there and instead of attempting to be stealth, they all wore red and so everyone could tell they were the regular idiots.
|
|
|
Post by Frank on May 2, 2014 8:57:50 GMT -4
So what did you think? I like the step system and it wouldn't affect laineys taxes. It seemed like a good solution.
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on May 2, 2014 9:24:53 GMT -4
So what did you think? I like the step system and it wouldn't affect laineys taxes. It seemed like a good solution. I agree and reducing the number of lots down so that they do not overwhelm the existing homeowners seems fair. But, the lies keep coming from those who are adamantly opposed to correcting this problem. Delay or deny seems to rule the day. I am pretty sure the commissioners see right through that but who knows. Even if this voted on, the first homes being connected would not be till 2018 and the last homes in 2030.
|
|
|
Post by burnerbill on May 2, 2014 10:04:21 GMT -4
There is a point at which doing nothing is doing more harm than good. This is a decades long dilemma and needs a resolution. There is no way it will make everyone happy. Right now there appears to be about the best middle of the road solution with other elements in place to make it happen which could be lost forever with further delays.
What was interesting is some of the comments of the opponents were so off the beaten path. Asking the county to look at alternatives would only open the flood gates for more development because there would be no way you could then stop a lot owner from building. Would KIDL and QACC go to the lot owners in Bay City and Cloverfields and tell them to stop building? These nine communities are already established and can't be considered new development. All that has happened is the county placed a moratorium on new construction on septic in SKI. Also, for some opponents to ask the commissioners to delay the vote because it is an election year is amusing. One speaker said he did not trust this group of commissioners. Why? Because they appear to be supporting the SKI Project and he is against it. What if the current group appeared to be going the opposite way? Would the same gentleman say he "trusts" this group because they support his position? Lastly, for some to claim this is a "rush" to judgement, I guess they forgot this has been going on for decades.
|
|
|
Post by lainey on May 2, 2014 11:36:42 GMT -4
So what did you think? I like the step system and it wouldn't affect laineys taxes. It seemed like a good solution. I agree and reducing the number of lots down so that they do not overwhelm the existing homeowners seems fair. But, the lies keep coming from those who are adamantly opposed to correcting this problem. Delay or deny seems to rule the day. I am pretty sure the commissioners see right through that but who knows. Even if this voted on, the first homes being connected would not be till 2018 and the last homes in 2030. It seems fair to you to tell lot owners they have to decide which one of them gets to buy out the others to build? Yes, it would because you are not affected by them. You will toss them under the bus to suit your own needs. I bet you one of them hires a lawyer and challenges this and the whole thing goes down the drain, or the sewer, from there. We were promised limited growth before in Bay City and Cloverfields. You better believe new roads got cut and growth was not limited. Are there still vacant lots in both communities, yes a few, very few.
|
|
|
Post by Frank on May 2, 2014 12:20:53 GMT -4
I, for one, am a cheap SOB. I don't want to pay an extra $100/month if I don't have to. But the reality is, it's the right thing to do. It's right for the enviroment, and it's right for the homeowners with failing septics and falling home values because of the septic.
The cost is fully burdened by the users of the system, not other county residents. Why should lainey care if they construct this or not. It doesn't affect her taxes. People talked about looking into alternatives, well the step system is an alternative to constructing a sewer system similar to Bay City and Cloverfields. It's a third the cost and only pumps the liquid waste, but that's the problem in SKI - too much water. People complained about 500 additional homes, not enough police protection, etc. They fail to realize 500 additional homes brings in approx $3,000,000 in additional tax revenue. More services could be provided with additional revenue. That is, as long as officials don't piss it away!
|
|
|
Post by cruzincat on May 2, 2014 15:20:09 GMT -4
$3,000,000.00 divided by 500 = $6,000.00. I doubt the new home owners would be paying that much per year in RE taxes, even with the extra $1,200.00 for the sewer. However, when you factor in the jobs that it would create, at least for a few years, it would help the local economy.
Existing homeowner may forget that with the new sewer comes a yard that might now be able to accommodate an in ground pool, since you no longer have to keep an area for drain fields open. In most double lots that is probably about 70% of the back yard you would be able to claim for just about any use, as long as the non permeable area does not exceed allowances.
|
|
|
Post by cruzincat on May 2, 2014 15:22:03 GMT -4
I wasn't able to attend the meeting. Did anybody ask about guarantees of no increase in the $100.00 per month charge, later on?
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on May 2, 2014 15:37:28 GMT -4
I wasn't able to attend the meeting. Did anybody ask about guarantees of no increase in the $100.00 per month charge, later on? Yes. Mark Anderson won't shut up about it. The $70 is fixed for the 20 year bond life but the $30 can be subject to a 2.5% increase. In real terms that means is could cost less than $30 adjusted for inflation in the future. That is if inflation averages 3% as it has in the past.
|
|
|
Post by lainey on May 2, 2014 16:31:42 GMT -4
I, for one, am a cheap SOB. I don't want to pay an extra $100/month if I don't have to. But the reality is, it's the right thing to do. It's right for the enviroment, and it's right for the homeowners with failing septics and falling home values because of the septic. The cost is fully burdened by the users of the system, not other county residents. Why should lainey care if they construct this or not. It doesn't affect her taxes. People talked about looking into alternatives, well the step system is an alternative to constructing a sewer system similar to Bay City and Cloverfields. It's a third the cost and only pumps the liquid waste, but that's the problem in SKI - too much water. People complained about 500 additional homes, not enough police protection, etc. They fail to realize 500 additional homes brings in approx $3,000,000 in additional tax revenue. More services could be provided with additional revenue. That is, as long as officials don't piss it away! EXactly my point Frank! Yes, those additional 500 homes will require additional services, like school buildings. The last school we built cost like 15 million. Their taxes wont be enough to cover their impact on our community, as JBQ pointed out, no impact fees as this is not new development. And that is why I have an issue with SKI Sewer, those new folks will be a drain on this already overtaxed bedroom community. We get all the costs and none of the benefits. We get to educate those new 500 homes full of kids. We get to provide emergency medical services, we will need to patrol more densely populated communities in ski. Cloverfields used to be a very quiet community. Now that sewer is there, so is crime. Lots of service costs, a little new tax revenue, and the math does not equate to lower taxes, nor does the SKI sewer project only impact those residents of those communities. WE all get to pay for the other services.
|
|
|
Post by jackbquick on May 2, 2014 16:47:10 GMT -4
I, for one, am a cheap SOB. I don't want to pay an extra $100/month if I don't have to. But the reality is, it's the right thing to do. It's right for the enviroment, and it's right for the homeowners with failing septics and falling home values because of the septic. The cost is fully burdened by the users of the system, not other county residents. Why should lainey care if they construct this or not. It doesn't affect her taxes. People talked about looking into alternatives, well the step system is an alternative to constructing a sewer system similar to Bay City and Cloverfields. It's a third the cost and only pumps the liquid waste, but that's the problem in SKI - too much water. People complained about 500 additional homes, not enough police protection, etc. They fail to realize 500 additional homes brings in approx $3,000,000 in additional tax revenue. More services could be provided with additional revenue. That is, as long as officials don't piss it away! EXactly my point Frank! Yes, those additional 500 homes will require additional services, like school buildings. The last school we built cost like 15 million. Their taxes wont be enough to cover their impact on our community, as JBQ pointed out, no impact fees as this is not new development. And that is why I have an issue with SKI Sewer, those new folks will be a drain on this already overtaxed bedroom community. We get all the costs and none of the benefits. We get to educate those new 500 homes full of kids. We get to provide emergency medical services, we will need to patrol more densely populated communities in ski. Cloverfields used to be a very quiet community. Now that sewer is there, so is crime. Lots of service costs, a little new tax revenue, and the math does not equate to lower taxes, nor does the SKI sewer project only impact those residents of those communities. WE all get to pay for the other services. Lainey, I never said no impact fees? Every lot will pay an impact fee of around $10,000. The purpose of the fee is to pay for all those services you are talking about above. Each new home will pay annual property taxes to share the cost of services all homeowners get.
|
|