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Post by tomc on Dec 2, 2012 21:59:19 GMT -4
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Post by kiboater on Dec 2, 2012 22:53:05 GMT -4
It has to be encouraging to the government that someone believes their press releases. Think about just how you determine that something saved a life.
But at least they are not wasting their time because like Barnum said There is a .........born every minute.
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Post by kiboater on Dec 2, 2012 22:59:27 GMT -4
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Post by georgej202 on Dec 2, 2012 23:46:03 GMT -4
Tomc believes everything the government and MSNBC says
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Post by markp on Dec 3, 2012 15:47:05 GMT -4
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 3, 2012 16:45:39 GMT -4
You mean a government agency is pleased to announce their testing shows that their program works? Shocker.
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Post by cranky64 on Dec 3, 2012 21:25:06 GMT -4
On top of that try getting the equipment fixed in 5 years when your dash lights up like a Christmas Tree (Holiday Tree for some). I have so many lights lit up on my dash I need black electrical tape to keep it from blinding me at night.
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 3, 2012 22:11:05 GMT -4
Guess what else prevents accidents; Stronger testing.
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Post by mongrel on Dec 9, 2012 19:50:35 GMT -4
It's not MSNBC. It's MSLSD!
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Post by alleycat on Dec 10, 2012 8:05:10 GMT -4
And how are the majority of you people different? You have a kneejerk reaction to ridicule anyone with a different view. Seems that you are the sheep, believing everything your buddies and FOX say, as if you have some superior intelligence and knowledge of everything. Such endless, all encompassing cynicism is not pretty.
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 10, 2012 9:19:59 GMT -4
^ Let me guess, you just woke up?
Trying to make a quantified correlation between ESC and saved lives is laughable.
There are too many other variables to account for in accident avoidance or recovery.
What government regulations on cars DOES do, without question, is make them heavier and more expensive, because of all the extra equipment.
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Post by tomc on Dec 10, 2012 11:55:52 GMT -4
Feel free to turn off your ESC and leave it off. Natural selection will take it's course in time.
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 10, 2012 12:59:29 GMT -4
I've had traction control and/or esc on several vehicles, and I frequently turn it off.
The technology is getting better, but it can be a real hindrance at times. When you pull out into a rural highway with traffic coming with what should be enough room to accelerate, and your tires spin a little with T C off, unless you suck at driving, you'll still be alright. With some traction controls, they cut so much power, you'll be sitting dead in the water waiting on the system to recover and give you fuel back, with traffic barreling down on you.
How did we ever survive without the nanny state and their nanny devices?
I know how. We learned how to drive. We learned how to recover a skid. We learned how to feather the clutch and gas pedal to control acceleration.
The only car I've not turned off the ESC automatically, as soon as I start it up, is my Audi. That is because it is so good, and non intrusive. With an awd vehicle, it is hardly necessary, but you'd never know it was there anyway.
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Post by freefallin on Dec 10, 2012 13:27:43 GMT -4
Okay, Tom C, here is the funny part about your article: They government agency is quick to pat itself on the back about saving 2,200 lives over three years by requiring this device, so let’s look at the numbers:
As of 2009 there were 193,552,000 licensed drivers in the United States. Per the 2009 census there was 254,212,610 vehicles on the road. Let’s use the lower number, the licensed drivers to be conservative. If they want to take a three year sample, we need to take the annual number of drivers on the road and multiply that by 3 so that is 193,552,000 x 3 = 580,656,000 drivers on the road over a three year period (if you got lost in the commas, that is almost 600 million). Now that number does not include passengers remember so let’s keep it conservative and just use the drivers on the road over the three year period:
Article states that 2,200 lives were saved over three years by them requiring this device and if we convert that to a percentage of the total drivers on the road over three years and we get a whopping .0000038 % safety improvement factor. The government PR person that put this press release out should be fired, but we all know, that never happens in government. They are still high fiving themselves over all the great regulatory work they created.
I bet billions was spent on that and again, we can thank government to coming to the rescue and being so efficient.
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Post by tomc on Dec 11, 2012 21:11:51 GMT -4
Yes Robbie. We all know you're the BEST driver EVAH! You tell us every chance you get.
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 11, 2012 21:36:01 GMT -4
And we know you would create a traffic jam to ruin our day if you ever drove without electronic aids.
Perhaps in the next 4 years, when Obama fixes the economy, you'll be able to afford a professional driver to chauffeur you around in an armored car. Then, you won't be so scared as you venture out into the world.
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Post by bchevy on Dec 11, 2012 21:56:22 GMT -4
I used to drive to North Dakota without a cell phone OR a GPS!
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 11, 2012 22:43:59 GMT -4
If you see polar bears, turn around. You went too far
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Post by tomc on Dec 12, 2012 9:29:25 GMT -4
Okay, Tom C, here is the funny part about your article: They government agency is quick to pat itself on the back about saving 2,200 lives over three years by requiring this device, so let’s look at the numbers... blah blah blah... It's a FACT that highway deaths have been decreasing over the years. This is due because of regulations requiring safety innovations and changes to vehicles, highways, and education. FACT. Even though these facts don't fit into your limited cognitive ability, doesn't make them any less true.
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Post by RobMoore on Dec 12, 2012 10:13:39 GMT -4
quote] Highway deaths have been decreasing over the years. Fact This is due because of regulations requiring safety innovations and changes to vehicles, highways, and education. Assumption
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Post by deputy on Dec 12, 2012 12:32:40 GMT -4
quote] Highway deaths have been decreasing over the years. Fact This is due because of regulations requiring safety innovations and changes to vehicles, highways, and education. Assumption Awesome post... also- FACT: All of the regulations for "safety devices"- the regulations didn't come 1st. 1st we had someone invent something, then that someone sold the idea to the government to get it required by law... so hence once again, it's about MONEY, not safety Blinkers Seat belts Emission controls Air bags the Black Box in GM cars driving headlights ABS Traction Control
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