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Post by Scott on Dec 19, 2006 20:26:05 GMT -4
Does anyone have any news on what's happening with the K-HOV deal? Last I heard was to wait until Dec. for a descision.
Any latest news?
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Post by Eric on Dec 20, 2006 0:48:54 GMT -4
The latest that I heard was that K-Hov is now sueing QA County for costing the company millions by delaying the project, which will delay the project even more. It's basically a game of chicken to get the county to grant approval or else face a huge lawsuit that teh county will surely lose. K-Hov will build here, but it will be a while.
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Post by anybody on Dec 20, 2006 9:49:31 GMT -4
What? The County hasn't been delaying the project. All of the lawsuits are by private citizens. The most recent appeal hearing was last week. It usually takes a couple of months for an opinion
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thomas
Full Member
Welcome to the Land of Pleasant Living!
Posts: 169
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Post by thomas on Dec 20, 2006 15:06:09 GMT -4
How is the county holding up the project? They messed with the maps, didn't they? To reduce the amount of protected watershed...?
Also, when they bought the land, they were taking a gamble. Did they have a written guarantee that after buying the land, they could build on it?
I'm no lawyer, but it sounds to me like they don't have a leg to stand on, legally.
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Post by matt on Dec 20, 2006 16:29:38 GMT -4
Sorry, Thomas, but they have a big leg to stand on... it's green and carries a lot of weight. Says something about "Legal" tender, oddly enough.
They have more money than QA County; unfortunately, that means they've got the edge.
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Post by andrewd on Dec 21, 2006 12:48:22 GMT -4
Gotta agree with Matt unfortunately. I read somewhere that K-Hov's suit against QAC says that the county has cost them millions by illegally stalling their project, yadda, yadda. My best guess is that K-Hov are suing QAC for a large sum of money so that QAC will back down and greenlight everything with the hopes of K-hov then dropping the suit against them. If K-Hov does sue and win, they will really hurt the entire county badly.
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thomas
Full Member
Welcome to the Land of Pleasant Living!
Posts: 169
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Post by thomas on Dec 24, 2006 8:20:33 GMT -4
I guess my beef is with "illegally" stalling their projects. What did we do that was illegal? A county has the right to oppose a project that we DO NOT want.
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Post by Scott on Feb 10, 2007 11:44:03 GMT -4
I assume that this is still in the courts. Is there any news? It sounds like this could go on for years!
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Post by Joyce on Feb 14, 2007 15:53:10 GMT -4
I heard you can blame Bob Foley and Gene Ransom for holding this project up and it looks like we are having to dish out thousands becuz the commissioners did not look at what was really on the table. The greenies were just looking for loopholes. I called the KHov office and they are planning on marketing in full swing this Fall and if anybody else plans to sue they are going after them personally. Sorry Foley and Ransom. By the way these new commissioners need to grow a back bone and quit letting Ransom intimidate them. Have you noticed that all the votes have been 5-0? I think they have something that they want to prove to the public --that they are all going to get along so they will also vote along mentality. Yea right! It has to end sometime.
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Post by matt on Feb 14, 2007 16:06:37 GMT -4
So, Joyce... should the wishes of the public (largely against) have nothing to do with it?
The land was NEVER intended for that level of development intensity. Why should it NOT be fought? Why can't it be developed as originally intended (several large lots)? KHov bought the land figuring they could change the rules of the game, and people like you are ignorant enough to support them.
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Post by thomas1 on Feb 14, 2007 17:23:41 GMT -4
Amen, Matt!
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Post by bchevy on Feb 14, 2007 19:47:41 GMT -4
You GO Matt!
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Post by shadow1 on Feb 15, 2007 9:11:04 GMT -4
Tell her Matt!!!
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Post by falgar25 on Feb 15, 2007 9:19:37 GMT -4
While I agree with matt's sentiments and I wish things had happened differently, are we beating a dead horse here and spending thousands to do it? If there's a chance of defeating this development, then I'm all for the lawsuits. On the other hand, if we're just spending more and more money to put off the inevitable, then there are probably better ways for that money to be spent.
The Commissioners from a few terms back screwed us, and it looks like they did a very good job at it.
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Post by matt on Feb 15, 2007 10:20:02 GMT -4
In a perfect world, the lawsuits would lead to ousting KHov.
In a just world, we could force them to scale back to something more reasonable.
In the real world, we can delay the project long enough to get a pound of flesh and perhaps cause other a$$hat, no-good, ratfink, bastidge developers to look elsewhere for such illegal scams. Maybe, if we're lucky, we'll do better than that and approach justice.
Any commissioner appproving this development must be removed from office immediately. If an opportunity to voice an opinion against this crap development comes up, it does absolutely zero good to hold your tongue. Make a little noise and perhaps, just perhaps, someone up the food chain will listen. Silence is aquiescence to these developers, trust me.
BTW, my position isn't entirely unreasonable:
If KHov pulled back to 600' (rather than the required 300' - LET ALONE the assinine 100' currently proposed!) from the water, purchased development rights elsewhere in the county equivalent to the difference in dwelling units (1400-15 or so would be 1385+ dwelling units), and turned that land into ironclad preservation area, turned their development into more intense and less sprawling plans, paid for the new hospital and fire station, and committed to other community improvements.... I'd consider shutting my mouth. Basically - lose most of the profit (not revenue) into community projects and preservation... that would be justice enough.
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Post by mikey on Feb 15, 2007 11:10:10 GMT -4
The thought of 1350 homes lining both sides of the cross-island trail turns my stomach. Its such a peaceful stretch through the woods and across cox creek and by Malcome Creek where the swans roost in the spring time. All that would be developed.
I agree with matt.
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Post by kl on Feb 15, 2007 13:04:44 GMT -4
KHOV is all over the tri-state area. Think this is bad..What's even worse is where it's being built near Chesterview Farm.
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Post by uvrays on Feb 15, 2007 15:31:23 GMT -4
It's quite obvious by Joyce's statements that she hasn't been paying attention to the KHov situation. Let's face it, Commissioners O'Donnell, Davis and McQueeny gave away the store. That administration then signed the agreement AFTER they were voted out of office, and on a Saturday to boot!
As Commissioner, Ransom continually voted no against KHOV.
Foley, as a private citizen, sued KHOV to stop the development. That is his right. Seems as if anytime a development gets shot down in QAC, the developer sues and gets what they want. So, why not a private citizen? Anyway, Foley and plantiffs must be doing something right because the judge keeps finding in their favor.
Fight on Foley and Ransom!
As for the 5-0 voting, perhaps the commissioners are voting that way because the issues they are voting on is in the best interests of the citizens of our county! What a novel idea. Doing what is best for the majority of the citizens.
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Post by outlaw on Feb 15, 2007 21:59:12 GMT -4
Ransom promised to fight this and has kept his word. It's no coincidence that he was re-elected. As for private citizens having the guts and stamina to fight this, bravo to them.
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Post by shorti on Feb 16, 2007 15:44:54 GMT -4
kudos to those private citizens standing up & fighting for what they believe in...
however - i have one thing to say - do any of you actually know KHOV?? do you know who owns KHOV?? it's not going to be an easy task - he has an ENDLESS supply of money...
best of luck to the citizens involved... i'm mixed on this issue - i think development is good - but to a point... ruining acres of wetlands or something along those lines i think is ridiculous... increasing the values of other homes in the area... good... unless of course you want to buy a house - then you're screwed. see mixed - 2 personalities on this issue.... but did want to bring up the owner of khov...
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Post by matt on Feb 16, 2007 16:53:47 GMT -4
** Yes, I know the owner of K Hovnavian rather well, thanks. More than just by reputation. Just because there's a rich bastidge doesn't mean people ought to shut up and roll over. More than any other single irritant here is the reduction in critical area and setbacks. IMHO, that point alone represents a complete disregard for the rules even the rest of the development community is required to play by.
KHov is a business. They're in this for the long haul - but that doesn't mean indefinitely. If the citizens, and especially if our representatives, continue to fight hard enough... the delays will become tiresome even to Hovnavian.
Hell, out of spite I'm happy to see this cost them money - it might be the only justice we get in the end.
**Note: shorti, this isn't intended to be rude or even argumentative to you. Just think it important to point out to people that fighting the good fight in spite of outrageous wealth only makes it a better fight to fight.
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Post by shorti on Feb 16, 2007 17:19:31 GMT -4
no no no - i agree wholeheartedly w/ you matt!!! i think that anyone who fights for what's the right thing & for a good cause - is worthy in my book - the fact that they fight as hard as they do knowing the power & wealth they are up against... even better... i was just trying to point out that hugo is ridiculously wealthy - he actually has a "compound" (for lack of a better word) where his exec's and family live in davidsonville... so he has the $$ to continue to fight this not caring what it costs the citizens of the county he wants to develop. critical area & setbacks or any other regulation should not be discarded because of $$$... with the market slumping over the past year & when other companies were dumping land they already owned, etc... it just shows their determination to continue to push when everyone else was walking away...
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Post by baycitydan on Feb 16, 2007 17:22:48 GMT -4
The only thing here that I'm concerned with is that the law sides with K-Hov and allows them to sue the county. Then we are getting screwed two ways. It sucks that K-Hov is coming in against pretty much everyone's wishes and endangering weland areas, etc., but unfortunately it is going to become a reality sooner or later.
I still don't understand why they had to come to a place and knowingly swindle the wetland areas. They had to expect community backlash too. It would have just made so much more sense for them to go across the Narrows bridge and build the neighborhood in an area that has the proper amount of legal land. By going for KI, they missed the real estate boom, and missed out on a lot of money. Bad move.
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Post by bchevy on Feb 18, 2007 9:22:59 GMT -4
I still don't understand why they had to come to a place and knowingly swindle the wetland areas. It's what developers DO. They could give a big crap about wetlands, laws, and citizens. They are in it for the big bucks, and the big bucks are close to the water IE: WETLANDS. (look at the builder with the island house in the Severn river with NO permits) KHOV Isn't even bright enough to come up with different names for their crap developments. What if we had a Bay City, and a Cloverfields Just across the Bay Bridge, AND just across the Kent Narrows Bridge? Wouldn't that make sense? Send 'em packin'
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Post by Mr Realistic on Mar 13, 2007 10:26:10 GMT -4
Has anyone really thought about agreeing to K-Hov's plan to build, but only if they pull back to 300' from the water line and cutting the planned units from 300 to say half that amount, so the place does not look like a crowded mess.
Development can do justice to the land, but only if done properly to enhance the land, not turn it into lego land.
It is coming. Concentrate on making it as least painful as passable. Something everyone can live with. If K-hov wins and goes with the original high density plan, the land will lose.
I wonder what K-hov would think of this idea.
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